moggy lover

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Posts by moggy lover

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  14

  This site was originally PRO-JW???

  by Kudra in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i read in a recent post that this was the case.

  then i went and checked out the first topics- totally right- simon had actually removed a topic for being apostate-sympathizing.

  too weird!

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  moggy lover

  Thanks heaps, Simon. This site has been a great help for those who would have had no other place to go

  Cheers
• 
  22

  responding to the Reasoning book on birthdays?

  by BlackSwan of Memphis in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i am helping someone out with a response to a jw about birthdays.

  she wants to be able to have a comeback to his programmed response.

  i am looking at the reasoning book section on birthdays.

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  moggy lover

  The chapter on "Birthdays" as found in the "[Human] Reasoning book is trite, mostly bunk, and deceptively misleading in that it makes statements that are contextually misapplied.

  For instance the concluding sentence in the introduction says that birthdays "are not a Biblical practice" If that is the case then COs, Branch Overseers, WTS Presidents, Circuit Assys, District Assys, wedding rings on the left ring finger, driving cars, watching TV, eating pizzas, etc etc are'nt either. So what? You mean we should'nt do them? Where does one draw the line at unsuitability of practice, simply because it is'nt a "biblical" practice.

  The [Human] Reasoning book misses the point of both the birthday celebrations mentioned in Scripture. Because blood was spliied on those days the conclusion is drawn that it is the PRACTICE that is condemned. By the same "reasoning" we could conclude that because so many people are killed by cars on the road, driving should be banned. The point is that "Bad Drivers" and not the act of driving are the culprits. The birthdays mentioned were of men who tended to violence as a way of life, and who would have used any occasion to assert authority. So - it is the men involved NOT the day that was to be shunned. If anything all the Bible is cautioning against is:Don't behead anyone on your birthday!

  In the case of Pharoah's birthday, the point behind this, was'nt to tell us how bad the practice was, but that God in His prividence acted on that day. Pharoah's birthday was said to be on the "third day" [Gen 40:20. Third day? Third day of what? Well look at vs 19. Joseph was sharing a prison cell with two fellow inmates, one of whom was innocent, and one guilty. He then made a prophecy that in three days the innocent one would be vindicated, and the guilty party would pay for his crime by being hung.

  Was this remarkable prophecy fulfilled? Yes, the Bible assures us, and in the most remarkable of circumstances, which even Joseph did not evidently forsee.[vs 22]

  In the case of John the Baptist, it is assumed by the WTS that he was beheaded on that very day, of Herod's birthday. Nothing in the text allows us necessarily to draw that conclusion. Assumptions made by the WTS are distinctly imprecise when it comes to their dogma. They will leap down the throats of people who will assume that there were "three" wise men, but here at Herod's birthday they seem quite prepared to assume what the text does not choose to reveal. For all we know, John the Baptist could have been beheaded several days later and the head brought to Herod's daughter.

  Most of the scholars quoted by the WTS in that article in the "[Human] Reasoning" are indeed quoted out of the contextual range that they were writing about. A thorough reading of these will reveal a far more balanced point of view. Many, like the International Standard Bible Encyclopaedia tell of many good things that were done on a rulers birthday, amnesties being granted, for instance [Vol 1, pg 515]

  Jews have since antiquity, practised the celebration of the Bar-Mitzvah where a Jewish boy was considered to be a man on his thirteenth birthday. He was then said to be "Of age" Reference is even made of this in Jo 9:21 Without having kept some sort of record, the parents mentioned in that text would have had no idea when this had occured.

  A word of caution regarding the "[Human] Reasoning" book: Like all the other humbug produced out of the cesspool that is WT Headquaters, it is not written to enlighten or even to inform. It is written to mould and influence. Like all good propaganda, it does not investigate the truth, but presents that version of its own platform which best suits its own purpose. The R&F are made to feel so self-righteous at not celebrating birthdays that they don't have time to investigate the harsher aspects ot the organisation they are primed to seve.

  Cheers
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  1

  Generation change

  by unique1 in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i am trying to find the article for someone on the generation change.

  i remember it being within the parousia watchtower studies in 93 but i read them and didn't see it.

  anybody know the month date and year of the article or have a link to it?

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  moggy lover

  Try the Nov 1 and Nov 15 WT for 1995. I am pretty sure you'll find what you want in there

  Cheers
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  25

  Revelation chapter 9

  by NowImFree in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i have been researching revelation 9 and have recently come to the realization that the jws are claiming in their own literature that they themselves are the locust horde coming out of the abyss spoken of in revelation 9 and they are also claiming that their king is abaddon the king of the abyss who they say is jesus.

  in their old literature they used to say the abaddon is satan and now they have done a flip flop and say he is jesus!

  this is just amazing to me that they would say this.

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  moggy lover

  Personally, I would'nt trust a religion that could'nt tell Jesus from Satan.

  I mean, would you trust a doctor who could'nt tell your brain from your rectum????

  Cheers
• 
  94

  607 bce or 587 bce

  by jw in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  jerusalem 607 bce vindicated.

  why jehovahs witnesses are right for sticking to the bibles chronology of 607 bce for the destruction of jerusalem.

  arguments for 587 bce are scripturally flawed, causing four bible prophecies to fail.

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  moggy lover

  A slick presentation no doubt. [No, no, aunt Mavis, I said sLick, not sick] And about time too. It has taken 127 years [1879-2006] for the WTS to produce an authoratative statement of its chronological position. [That is I am assuming it is a WTS paper. It may on the other hand be written by surrogates]

  Unfortunately it adresses only one issue, that of the 70 years "desolation" of the land. Nowhere does the Bible actually speak of the period that the WTS calls the "70 year desolation" It does talk about "desolation", and it does use a period of 70 years. But NOWHERE is this connected in the SINGULAR.

  Actually this series of articles puts an interesting "spin" on the one text which speaks of a 70 year period of desolationS [plural] - Dan9:2 To all other intelligent readers of the Bible, this merely indicates that Jerusalem, [not the land] underwent three seperate "desolations" 1 In the first year of Nebuchadnezzar [Jer 25:11] 2 In Nebuchadnezzar's 7th year [2Chron 36:5-10] 3 And finally in his 19th year [2Kings 24:14]

  But not to the followers of the WTS. By the artful use of a paraphrase translation, [CEV] Dan 9:2 is made to say that Jerusalem would be in "ruins" [The metaphor "ruins" actually speaks of a single ruination, where for instance we can speak of a house being in "ruins"] By adopting this translation, certainly not accurate enough to preserve the literalness of the original Hebrew, the WTS apologists imply that Daniel is referring to a single event, one in 607 BC, from which one can then conveniently count back. If these anonymous writers were so concerned with "accuracy" one wonders why they did not accept th WTS "translation" of this verse? Are they implying that somehow the WTS and its [per]version of the Bible is wrong, and that Freddy Franz did'nt know Hebrew after all? If the writers of this article had the guts to face the facts thaey would acknowledge that Dan 9:2 is talking of "desolations" that befell Jerusalem.

  No consideration is given to the lengths of the various Kings of Babylon. 539 BC is accepted as an absolute date, when it is'nt. It is in fact caculated from an absolute date, which is the 37th year of Nebuchadnezzar.

  We need not be impressed by the WTS and its explanations, because anything, even a flat earth, can be "explained". And we do'nt need to be lectured to by men who have for ever stained their record with prophetic quackery. The Scriptures themselves tell us not to fear them for they are false prophets.[Dt 18:22]

  Cheers
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  15

  What happed if two Mormon Elders and two Jehovahs witness meet together?

  by Ray in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  anybody ?

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  moggy lover

  They'd probably be standing on a clocktower [watchtowers are in short supply in an urban enviornment] eating out of golden plates

  Cheers
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  16

  The Seven Thunders of Millennial Dawn!

  by Atlantis in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  dr. shadduck 1928 edition.

  i retyped out a couple of pages that were weak, however, if you still need a page or section retyped, then just send me a pm.

  any copyrights on this booklet would have been discontinued many years ago.

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  moggy lover

  Bless you my son, for this service rendered. May your seed increase till time indefinite, even for ever, and may your favourite ice-cream never run out of stock

  "The Seven Thunders" has dutifully been stored on my 'puter

  Cheers

  Moggy
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  25

  Metatron: Loss of Elders Confirmed

  by zack in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  wts wants only "company men.

  i am still in, but guess what?

  compassion, caring, ministering--- all the things that i thought i was called to do as a christian, as a sheperd---- no one really wants those things.

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  moggy lover

  To my way of thinking, what we are seeing unfolding before us is the rotten harvest resulting from years of focussing on the wrong goals. Sowing bad seed, if you like. Ever since the mid 20s when Rutherford forcefully, and deliberately altered the method of placing men into positions of leadership in the WT movement, from a congreational arrangement, to a highly controlled one dictated by the centre, we have seen the quality of leaders decline, sometimes markedly.

  When the travelling overseers of the society visit a local congregation, almost the first task they apply themselves to, is examining potential elders. The measuring rod used to assess the capacity for leadership, is a mechanical record of field service, which is thus carefully scutinized. And that is where the problem lies. The spiritual worth of an individual is measured in a physical capacity to adhere to the will of the centralized governing authority. No account is taken of other, more fitting qualities that make for spirituality, like a love for the Word of God, or a love for the fellowship of believers. Indeed there is NO other method of measuring spiritual qualifications that the WTS sees fit to regard.

  This is despite the Biblical record that we have preserved for us in the writings of the apostle Paul. Nowhere, in the fifteen elements that qualify a person for leadership in a local assembly of believers, as recorded in 1Tim 3:2-7, is any mention made of one's "field service" as such a qualification. Rather, the attention is focussed exclusively within the body of believers, on the inductee's ability to relate to, and aid the membership. Nowhere is "study" portrayed as a gift, but teaching, with gentleness and temperance is.

  By keeping a tight control on the ones they place into positions of leadership, [amusingly calling this a "theocratic" arrangement] the WTS has ensured that these men are as arrogant, unworthy, and self serving as themselves.

  They create a system of abject conformity and call it love. No wonder the congregations suffer as a result

  Cheers
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  3

  Having a Problem with Reexamine.org

  by JW_Researcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  for about a week now, when i click on the "shortcut to downloads page " on reexamine.org's front page, i am redirected to the main page again.

  in other words, i click on the link....i wait....and the same page (the home page) is reloaded and displayed.

  the url to which the link above points is

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  moggy lover

  I can confirm having trouble getting into the reexamine.com site. As you mentioned, it seemed to move me back and forth. But this new URL you put up does work. Looks like the WTs from 1920-29 are a new addition to the site

  Thanks
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  5

  Need References for early 30-40 year generations - Please + other questions

  by rassillon in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i have been working on several charts to help explain things better and i need an early watchtower reference or book reference which shows the wt's teaching that a generation was 30 or 40 years.

  any help is appreciated.

  ps, if anyone knows how i might come about a copy of the watchtower book shelf cd-rom from reexamine.org i would be most appreciative.

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  moggy lover

  I can't seem to get onto the reexamine.org site to download the WT CDs [the files were too big to download anyway] can anyone tell me where I can purchase them ?

  Cheers